Everything You've Ever Wanted to Know about Customer Success

Ready to translate clinical skills into tech impact? We sat down to unpack customer success through a clear business lens: what a CSM truly owns, how retention and expansion drive revenue, and why calm under pressure beats charm every time. We cut through the hype to outline the traits that actually matter: staying energized by customer-facing work, managing organized chaos, setting boundaries without flinching, and leading teams through the pain of change. If you ever wondered whether loving people is enough (you’ll hear why it isn’t) and how assertiveness, structure, and data turn good intentions into measurable outcomes.

We go deep on how to vet a CS org before you sign an offer. You’ll learn the difference between gross and net revenue compensation, how those incentives shape your day, and what red flags to catch early: weak sales handoffs, messy onboarding, unclear segmentation, and overloaded books. We also map how company stage changes the job and how product criticality and contract length shift your playbook from value extraction to adoption driving. We even talk funding dynamics and why CS must be a strategy, not a cost center, if you want a stable, rewarding path.

For interviews, we share the playbook: speak revenue, not just relationships. Bring fluency in GRR, NRR, churn, and expansion; show comfort with Asana, Notion, Salesforce, and Slack; and prove you can use AI to summarize calls, draft renewals, and analyze usage trends. We close with practical encouragement on tailoring applications, building community, and staying persistent when timing gets in the way.

If you’re a clinician eyeing SaaS or a CSM leveling up, this conversation gives you the tools, language, and confidence to move forward. Enjoyed the episode? Subscribe, share with a friend, and leave a quick review to help others find the show.

Find the Clinician Transition (TCT) Here:

• TheClinicianTransition.com
• The Clinician Transition Linkedin Group
• The Clinician Transition Slack Community

Other Relevant Resources

• Beyond These Clinic Walls
• Collective Coaching

Connect with the hosts here:

• Emma Brady, PT, DPT
• Emily Kelly, PT, DPT

Transcript

Welcome And Why CS Matters

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Good evening and welcome to another episode of the Clinician Transition. This is Emma Brady, and I am joined by Emily Kelly. Hello, friends, and Casey Francis. Hey y'all! And we are here for one of the most highly requested topics we have ever had, which is all about CS. And normally we do some sort of icebreaker, kind of get you in a fun mood. But right now, I am looking at a six-page document that Casey made of just the most incredible resources and thought-provoking things about CS to help you be prepared and be successful in the role. So I think tonight we're kind of just gonna dive into it because we want to get to as much as possible and also honor Casey's role in the first five episodes of the show. She's gonna be taking a little break after the show. We're gonna have either different guests or some other themes. So thank you, Casey. And I just can't think of a better way to have you end your what is it called in Vegas? Your residency with us like Adele. That's delightful. Thank you. I also want to recognize that Emily has a ton of customer success experience as well. So Emily is also gonna be chiming in and they have complementary but different CS experience. So talking of experience, this is gonna be experienced. So welcome and buckle up because we are gonna be successful with customer success. I love that. We're gonna set you up for success with customer success. Success and success. Yes. Yeah, with our two of the biggest CS superstars at the company we work for. All right. So let's dive in. Could you for our listeners and and maybe even for myself sometimes, could we just start off with in two sentences, maybe three? What does a customer success manager do? What is the purpose of their job?

SPEAKER_02 2:05

From a business sense, CS protects revenue and gains and gains revenue from customers that you already have. Back in the days when, like before software, it was all hardware. Companies didn't have to think about retaining customers because they just sold you the hardware, kept it on your device. They didn't have to keep you, it was done. When things transferred to the cloud and software, and more of a membership-based, then they have to work at keeping you, especially. There's all sorts of things about it. Now I'm already diving into it, but especially if it's like membership-based. Anyways, that's all a little bit of background of CS, but it's to retain revenue for the company. But in doing so, they also help customers achieve their goal. So like everybody wins.

Casey f 3:00

Yeah, it's kind of like a partnership too, in that respect. There's also like client relationship managers, too. There's even some in some places they call them customer account managers. Like you can every company can be different. But yeah, the the goal is retaining revenue for the company. And I think if you're coming from a clinical background, you might see at least when I started, this was a whole new world for me. And I thought about it as relationship management, with which it absolutely is. You're managing the relationship with the customers. But if for you guys out there who are coming from that background, switch your lens a little bit to what Emily is talking about and think about business. Think about retaining business. And that's how you can best prepare to switch gears and show up really well prepared for interviews and for, you know, and also just for deciding if this is the path that interests you.

Skills And Mindset For CS Fit

SPEAKER_00 3:56

I mentioned this earlier, get lots of inquiries about customer success. Some of that is because it's a natural transition coming from the clinical background, like you said, Casey, it's relationship management, helping people be successful. And then also, you know, frankly, you don't have to go to school to do it. So it's not a huge barrier to entry. Could you kind of help us walk through like additional skills that you need to have or things you like to do or don't like doing for this job to be a fit for you? Totally.

Casey f 4:27

And Emily, I'll let you speak to this too. But the first thing that jumps into my mind is well, I mean, and this is a good, a good thing, I think, for everyone who's a clinician. If this is part of the job that you like, is you are gonna be with customers and you're gonna be customer facing pretty much all day long. You do a lot of behind the scenes work too, but you are on your and you're on meetings and you're constantly managing chaos. Like you are, you've got to be really organized in that chaos. So you have to have attention to detail, but also, you know, your priorities are always changing based on what the customer's needs are and what their priorities are. So you have to be organized, you have to be really energized by other people and working face to face, whether that's like virtually face to face, is still you're still interacting with them and you're asking, you're answering questions a lot, you're following up a lot, you're on the spot a lot, to be honest. Which I mean you could get that with your patients too. So some of that could be similar, but if that's not draining for you, that's a good sign. That if that's not if that's a green flag, then great. What would you say, Emily?

SPEAKER_02 5:42

What what other ditto to what you're saying about people working with people gives you energy. If you're in the clinic and you're like, oh my gosh, I would rather lock myself in a closet and put my head down into a project, you are going to struggle in customer success. You are gonna be with people a lot. And it's actually, I compare it to patient care. It's like the patient care of the SaaS world, really. So if you want to do patient care for a SaaS company, really, it's like client care. That's what a lot of CS is. One thing that I hear a lot of people say, so I want to call this out, is they want to do CS for the relationship aspect because they love relationships. And while that is true, relationships are key. Sometimes people confuse being good at relationships with being a people pleaser. And in CS, you cannot be a people pleaser. You have to be assertive and confident in your software, be able to set boundaries and expectations, and be able to manage conflict head on. You cannot shy away from conflict. That is a huge valuable skill in C. Totally true.

Casey f 6:53

You have to be able to like push back a lot professionally in a professional way with customers because they're always going to be asking for, there's no way you'll you'll ever be a CSM without at least at some point a customer for asking for some feature or some uh thing that that your software doesn't have for whatever reason, or that's just like a basic scenario that would be run of the mill, but there's about a zillion others. And also, this is people's business and their money and their profession, and they are assertive about that too. Patients, while yes, they're going through a lot of them could be going through a hard time, they're on their healing journey, they look to you a lot of the times as the expert. They want to get better, they follow. I mean, you know, obviously it you can have some wide range of patients, but it is a different vibe, to be honest. Like it's it's a different vibe of these customers who are, you know, really trying to get their needs met at the same time and then trying to like negotiate with you on things and get things done, and you're having to really be confident and in what you know and what you can offer and what you can do and what you can't do.

SPEAKER_02 8:05

One more thing to add on to that, too, is we get this a lot, and this translates into product actually. It's hard for people to change, even when they're changing to something different. It is hard for them to change. You could be working like we are at the best software company in the world, and it's still hard for people to change their processes. And so change management and leading people through that painful process of changing is another big skill.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

Well, thank you. I feel like that's a good foundation and it perfectly lines me up for where I wanted to go next. We just covered what the profile is of someone who might enjoy this job and the the challenges they may find. What's the word? Like stimulating and professionally rewarding. Okay, so I'm I'm this is me. I want to do this still. How do I know if I'm interviewing for companies and doing outreach that I'm applying to a company that has a strong and supportive CS organization?

Boundaries, Pushback, And Conflict

SPEAKER_02 9:05

There's a lot of good questions you can ask. One is how are you being compensated? And is it okay if we kind of go down this road already? I feel like people would love for you to go down this road. Okay. Let's talk about the money. Let's talk about the money. And this can also be a good way for you to show off your knowledge and your research that you have done for this interview, because you have done research. You can ask about how you're compensated. One way that people, uh companies can compensate you if you do get bonuses is based on gross revenue. Or they can compensate you on net revenue. They can also do a combo. Gross revenue, if you're only compensated on gross revenue, you are going to get penalized anytime someone turns. This can be good, it can be bad, it's just a thing. But the thing you need to know about being compensated on gross revenue is it's a fact of life. Sometimes customers are not a fit. Maybe they don't really fit your profile, they never should have bought, and they actually need to churn. But if you're compensated on gross revenue, you're going to be chasing those bad fit customers all day long. And it might not be so fun. If you're compensated on net revenue, net revenue looks at a bigger picture. So it not only looks at your current customers and what they initially bought, but it also looks at cross-sells and upsells and additional revenue that you're getting from your current customers. So let's say you lose one or two customers, they weren't a good fit, even though you're an awesome CSM. You can make that up if you're compensated on net revenue by making sure you're having intelligent discussions with people who would benefit from other parts of your software that cost more money, or you're helping them grow. And in our case, you're helping them hire more therapists or open more clinics, for example. Net revenue can be a little bit more generous, but you definitely want to ask on how you are compensated, and you can you can sneak in some of those terms.

SPEAKER_00 11:08

And is it safe to assume that? I mean, maybe it's with both, but the net revenue, I was hearing more things that might make me think I have more of a sales component than I might be anticipating. I think that's well, I don't want sales, so I'm gonna do customer success. Right. Well, got news for you. Customer success, most is a fair say most of the time customer success does have what pe most people traditionally would think of as a sales component. Yes, a hundred percent.

SPEAKER_02 11:38

You're almost certainly gonna be in some way related in selling.

SPEAKER_00 11:43

And that's kind of a nice thing because typically one of the reasons people are drawn towards CS is it does have a more predictable salary. So you kind of get the best of both worlds where you've got that base salary, but then you also have a bonus potential if you're good at your job. And if you're a therapist, you're probably gonna be pretty good at your job, if especially if it's a good fit for you, and the upsells, because that is something that really directly correlates with what you're doing in patient care, most likely. And along with this theme, it's also the reason why we need to talk about having a strong CS organization, because it's a lot easier to sell something if you're happy and you give a you know what about it.

How To Vet CS Organizations

Casey f 12:24

Right. And you also need to have, I would ask too, like, how is the relationship between, I would ask the the person who I was interviewing me, what's the relationship between the CS team and the sales team? Like, are they strongly aligned? Because if they're not, if they're not communicating, it's a constant pain point. Um, because you are gonna partner with sales when they do the handoff, you want to make sure everybody communicates. There's a standard way to do that, that they're you know, a close-knit at least structure in the way to do that, because you're gonna be involved in that too. And even asking, like, what does onboarding for the customer look like? So that you know, is that an organized process? Is that does that sound really nicely set out and smooth? If it doesn't, you know that that could be a churn risk later. That could be setting you up to not be successful. You could always ask why did the last person in this role leave and be you know, be surprised if that reveals something. And then I would also just ask, what is a healthy CSM book of business look like? You know, it's a red flag if they're gonna be like, well, they're not really segmented out. Uh, you might have some like 200 so accounts that are just there. And other jobs might have a really clear segment. Like we have enterprise that deals with about this many accounts. We have small business or small, what is it, small mid-sized business simile. And then maybe we have low touch customers versus high touch. I mean, every company's gonna do it a little bit differently, but if they have a strong plan and they're really mature in that process, that is really nice, unless you want to start a startup and help build that out. Like go for it. But if you you don't, if you don't want to have the it's a trade-off, right? Like if you want to start for a startup, you're gonna have more autonomy and more say in how all this gets developed. If you're not looking to do that and figure all that out, go somewhere where it is so figured out and it's a well-oiled machine, and you can tell that on the interview by as you get farther along in these interviews, by their responses. What are what's the career progression?

Compensation: Gross vs Net Revenue

SPEAKER_02 14:32

If they have two CSMs, there's probably, well, maybe like an earlier stage company. There's no career progression, which is okay, like Casey was saying. That's not necessarily a red flag, but you have to know that that's what you want, and you're gonna be okay handling any size of customer. Along those lines, too, you want to know the stage of the company because you're just gonna be doing wearing more hats at an earlier stage company. And that's what Casey and I experienced. Earlier stage, you might be doing onboarding, CS, business reviews, support. Later stage, and there's not a lot of segments yet. So every type of customer, mid and later stage, you might just have startups or you might just have SMB and then move into mid-market and enterprise or something like that. So just know where your strengths are and what you're comfortable jumping into. You also want to think about what type of product is it? A type of product like prompt, it is essential to run their everyday business. And so there is no way that people aren't using the product. And so for that reason, a lot of the traditional CS concepts didn't really apply to us because we weren't like trying to get them to use this little add-on widget. They had to use it all the time. And because of that, they're more knocking on our door than we are knocking on their door. And so then it becomes the CSM really has to be good at process and scaling and boundaries and giving the customer the most value with every like minute of their time. Whereas if you the type of product that you're working for, the type of SaaS product, if it's not something essential to business or they just log in here and there throughout the day or look at it a couple of times a week, you are going to be almost like prospecting them more and like trying to get on their schedule more, trying to get them on business reviews and stuff like that. So think about the type of product. And then the other thing you should ask about is the length of the contract. This is important because if the length of the contract is really long, let's say it's an annual contract or two-year contracts, you're only really fighting for that churn once or twice a year per customer. If it's a monthly contract, you are fighting for that subscription all the time with all of your customers.

Casey f 16:58

You can even ask what is the most common reason people churn? That would give you some info that would be interesting to see if that's something that intrigues you to try to solve.

SPEAKER_00 17:08

Yeah, because if they say, Well, yeah, we've had a hundred million requests and it's been two years and we haven't updated it.

Casey f 17:14

Ding ding ding.

SPEAKER_00 17:16

Yeah. Like I'm, you know, congrat congrats for getting the interview and getting so far. You don't want to probably work for that company. Right. You kind of when you were talking about the stage of company, just also wanted to acknowledge that stage and funding is another thing to consider. So you say you got a a company, they just you know, they're putting out press and out press releases, they just got a hundred gazillion dollars in funding. People don't just give money away because they feel like it, they want to make more money back than they gave. And depending on who's giving it, particularly if it's a private equity company, they want it back in three to five years. So just some just look out for patterns, especially if the company is taking on multiple rounds, meaning multiple lump sums of money from outside investors and see what happens to the CS department, because a lot of these companies see customer success as a cost. And so just thinking, I'm not trying to scare anyone, but just thinking about the job stability. Be mindful of that as you're poking around.

Sales Reality Inside CS

SPEAKER_02 18:20

Emma, that that strikes a chord with me too, because I feel and felt so lucky to be part of CS's or CS's prompt's CS team because prompt values CS so much. And we know like shade to the product, but we always bragged and we were like CS is our highest rated feature, and that we sell it as like a big part of our product, and we really value CS. So it's heavily invested in. So that might be another thing to dig into is how invested is the company in the CS team. But also, if you read like CS books, they always say customer success is really like a company strategy. The whole company should be thinking about churn and retention.

SPEAKER_00 19:06

So speaking of the company, let's shift gears a little bit. We've learned about what what it is, what makes us good at it, what we need to look for in a company to see where we want to work. Now I've landed the interview, or and I'm prepping for the interview, or I'm trying to get someone's attention. What do I focus on?

Sales-CS Alignment And Onboarding

Casey f 19:25

Yeah. And I think you can tell by our conversation so far. Again, this was my my uh perspective shift. It was less about the client relationship aspect, which I always was like, Well, I'm so good at relationships because I was a therapist. And it's more about learning about business, learning coming from the business mindset. Learn what you can just generally so that you can talk intelligently about revenue, the impact of revenue in interviews, so that you do separate yourself from the relationship only, quote unquote CSMs who are applying, who that's their big ticket. And so at least know like what is gross, like what Emily was even talking about. What is gross revenue retention? What is net revenue retention? What is churn rate? Make sure you're familiar with expansion, upselling, white space. There's so many business terms that that you can go learn about just to orient yourself, dig into, and represent yourself well. It's not hard, but you just don't know what you don't know until you go investigate. And switching that because you're dealing with business owners too. So on every call with a customer, that's what they're interested in, too, for their own business. So coming from that perspective is huge. What would you say, Emily? Anything to add to that? And f we talked about organized chaos. Well, investigate tools just so you even know them on a conceptual level that help you stay organized. We use Asana a lot. Some places use click up. We use Notion. So very what I mean, that's a very common knowledge management system. And Slack, hilarious if you haven't like that's a whole different way of communicating than you might be used to in a clinic. It's called async communication. Because it's like not at the same time happening, but you're doing it all day asynchronously. Whatever that word, how you say that word. I mean, that's our bread and butter, right, Em? Like you Yes, it's a switch.

SPEAKER_02 21:23

Yes. Huge switch. That was such a good point that you made of relationship only. Uh, because it's important, but someone may not like you, but if you helped their business earn millions of dollars, right. They are gonna sing your praises. They love you. They love you.

Casey f 21:39

Um, but like get to know get to know Slack, make sure you can represent yourself well that you know the etiquette of that. Like I think the first time I used Slack, it was in the general channel, which is like for everyone. And I uh actually tell the story. Yeah. It was like, you know, I was just be reviewing Slack. I put it on my phone. I was so excited about my new job. And I was just testing out all the stuff. And I pushed this little button in the top right corner. And it was like starting a huddle. And at that point, it was with everyone in the company. Everyone, including the all the co-founders, everybody. And it was like 11 30 p.m. And I didn't, and it was like, you know, and I was like, what is it doing? And then I threw my phone across the room in shame. Anyway, so trying to learn that stuff beforehand would be my advice. I mean, really nice. And then there are um HubSpot, Salesforce, even just knowing those that sales teams use, like we use that too, the basics of that. And um it's not just you just showing you're familiar with tools, but just showing you understand, hey, this is what my this job is going to entail. How do I track these things? I gotta track renewals, I gotta manage onboarding timelines, I gotta make sure sure things are visible for leadership. Like when they come and ask, what's the status on this? Am I do I feel confident in using a tool and a system to show them that? That visibility is huge. And to to say, like, yeah, I feel really good about this, I know a little bit about it. Even if you haven't used it, like you can speak to it, and that I think is important too. But Emily, you've probably done more. I mean, you you have interviewed a zillion people for these roles. Yes. Well, do you add anything to those?

SPEAKER_02 23:24

You know, one person that stuck out, and we hired them immediately, and they are one of the best prompt employees ever. Did that found out we used Asana, and he created his own Asana project and sent it to me, and we were like, we can't not hire this guy. Oh my god, he's the best.

SPEAKER_00 23:45

Like, yeah. I remember messaging and being like, if you don't if you do not hire this person, I will be furious because I was still involved at NCS interviews at that point. By the way, if you do want to practice, just a mini plug for the TCT Slack, which is linked at the bottom of this episode. Super safe space to get acquainted with a tool that very likely that your company is gonna use.

Segmentation, Book Size, And Stage

Casey f 24:09

Excel too. Obviously, we haven't mentioned Excel, but that's a huge one too. Get good at a pivot pivot tables. Um, you might even be yeah, you might even be asked that on an interview. I was asked that. I'm pretty sure. Can you do a pivot table? I was like, huh? No, I cannot. So it would have been better if I said, oh, absolutely. And then with the future of AI, that's huge. Like, make sure you can speak to you should be able to say things like, oh yeah, I I could use AI. Like, what could you use AI for in these roles? I could use AI to summarize call notes into structured entries. I could use AI to draft renewal recap emails, or to analyze, you know, usage data trends, or to role-play difficult situations, or to templatize onboarding workflows. Like you can you can literally go to AI and ask, how can I use you in a CS role and get a bunch of ideas, and then you could be able to speak to that on an interview. Because what's huge is future-proofing the fact that all these companies know we we need to be leveraging AI to be more efficient. And maybe they'll have internal ways and structures already planned out. It all depends on the company. But if you can say confidently that you feel really comfortable in that arena, that's gonna be a win in my book.

SPEAKER_02 25:28

Casey, you said a phrase that I want to dig into more, and that it was something about differentiating differentiating yourself from all the other clinicians because this is really important. All the rehab clinicians out there, we're all pretty darn good at our jobs, and we're all gonna be very competitive. Gone are the days where we can just say, Hey, I'm a PTOT SLP, and therefore you should hire me because I have all these transferable skills. That that is does not really hold up in an interview that's hiring lots of rehab therapists. So um, some of the things that do stand out are that business knowledge. If you can really dig into how you've used your business knowledge before, how you've used tools before, how you've used specific stories of how you have used AI before, that is going to be a big differentiator for you. The other thing that I wanted to mention is something that I um observed in interviews that I didn't initially expect to be a big differentiator is not just the answers, because anyone can like go to a, you know, go to Chat GPT and just memorize answers and just spit them out. But we we really try to give people questions that make them think on their feet and see how they respond. Can you keep your composure? Can you stay calm? Just that calmness and composure, if you can work on that and demonstrate that on an interview, that's huge. And it's something that we would talk about after interviews. They had such a good composure. So something I don't I don't think a lot of people talk about that, but if you can master your nervous system, you're gonna be really good in an interview and you're gonna be a very good CS.

Casey f 27:21

So true, Emily. Even though I don't appreciate you putting people on the spot in an interview and making them uncomfortable on purpose, I understand why you did that. And that is so true. Because that's the first thing you have to get used to, I think. For me, it was it was like you do sometimes feel like you're in the hot seat with customers because they're like everything you have to you have to learn this system, and then they're like, Well, then how do you do this? And you're like, like, and you can just feel yourself start sweating, like when you first start getting used to it, and then by the end you just have like nerves of steel, and you feel like you know they could just throw anything at you. But that's such a good that's such a good point. And you also love examples. That's the other thing that you love on interviews.

Product Criticality And Contract Length

SPEAKER_02 28:07

So come with actual examples from your real life, from your real life, and anyone who says the perfect answer, but they didn't give me an example. Oh, Emily just gonna have a hard time with it. She was so cut through with that.

Casey f 28:22

It sounded great, but no examples. So, what how do I know? What do I know?

SPEAKER_02 28:26

I mean, anybody could give the perfect theoretical answer, but tell me a time. Tell me a time, know your stories, prepare your stories ahead of time.

SPEAKER_00 28:37

As we kind of wrap up, what are other closing thoughts or wisdom you want to part on anyone that this conversation is relevant to?

Funding, Stability, And CS Investment

Casey f 28:45

I thought about this because this was kind of my last episode of the residency until my hiatus. So I thought, what would my parting words of wisdom be for people who are actively looking for a job right now? And this is what I I'll just tell you my tips for for this. That some of them you may have heard before, but just if any of these resonate with you, it'll be worth repeating. Transitioning can feel like an identity shift, not just a job change. So there's real grief and growth involved. There can be, and prep, you know, that's normal. So we need to normalize that. You you're not alone in that, and don't transition alone. Having that community like the TCT and honest conversations, it's not even a nice to have, it's a must-have in this kind of transition and in this job market today. And it cannot go, you cannot understate the importance of that. It's almost like an infrastructure, like that community. Please join it and learn Slack while you do. You know, join the TCT Slack, and then you you're knocking out two birds there with one stone. And what I did, y'all, it took me, you know, I got laid off from my insurance job where I was an uh prior off utilization because there was a company merger. So hundreds of people were laid off. They gave us about a six-month runway, which was nice of them, I guess, to let us know that you you're gonna be gone in six months. I must have applied for at least two to three jobs a week. And I treated every this was before Chat GPT, so it probably would have taken a lot less time, but I treated every resume and cover letter like a separate little project. So no two of mine were the same. And that was the biggest advantage I felt like I figured out, although now that's common knowledge, I'm sure of like, but for me, it was like a breakthrough of look at every single position like a separate little project and envision yourself already in that role and write from that future version of you because you are tweaking your resume and your cover letter to match that exact company and position, and that forces you to think through it. Like then you learn more about yourself if you let it and what you actually value and what you're looking for. So you just really that repetition of tailoring those applications, tailoring those resumes and cover letters, it can build self-trust and clarity along the way if you let it. So then you actually gain confidence through that if you think of it that way. And so then before the offer even comes, you're getting interviews that are getting stronger because you're more understanding your own story and your own narrative and how you got there. And every time you get rejected, just think this is another iteration. This is me getting closer to aligning with the right job. It's not a failure. I was rejected by prompt the first go round when I interviewed. It didn't even work out that first go round. And guess what? I applied again when a couple months later a spot opened up. If I had been knocked down by that rejection, I would not have this job. And was it hard for me to be like, I'm gonna go back to that job at interview again? Yes, that was a hard decision. I remember being like, if if I had let my ego get in the way, right, I would have been like, well, they didn't want me. But it was just was a timing. You never know. You have no idea behind the scenes of what's going on on the other side. You have to release yourself from that outcome or that personal projection. Anyway, I just want y'all to know, just keep after it and don't give up. And then also the caveat of everything we've said today and before on this podcast, which is switching careers does not magically solve everything. It's just different. It's different growth in a different direction. So be be well with that within your within your heart and go forth and do your best. And that's all you can do. And those would be my my words of advice. Casey, that was beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 32:44

That was just so, so Casey. That was just that was wonderful. My last thing that I want to say is I I mean, we got very real on this podcast, but I also don't want to leave this podcast without everyone knowing how awesome the role of a CSM is. It's hard. I'm not gonna shy away from that. And at the same time, it can be so rewarding. It's a great role if you love people, if you love problem solving, if you're business-minded. It can be a really rewarding career.

SPEAKER_00 33:17

Agree. Yeah, speaking of churn, at least in our experience, with hardly any of anyone who um churns from the customer success role at prompt. Back to just finding the right company, making sure it's the right fit for you. I mean, Casey and Emily have been in there for five years with uh like legendary career progression. So I appreciate you calling that out. And we hope the same for you. We really do. So please lean on the community. We have some episodes coming up that were planned based on some of the feedback that you gave in Slack. We're getting a ton of listens every week, so thank you. Please continue to share and listen and subscribe, and we'll be able to keep doing this for you. And thank you for listening and have a good night, and we'll we'll talk to you again soon. Bye.